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Tinderbox Users >> Documentation and Tutorials >> Tinderbox for dummies
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Message started by Jason Clark on May 9th, 2011, 4:25am

Title: Tinderbox for dummies
Post by Jason Clark on May 9th, 2011, 4:25am

I've bought and paid for Tinderbox (and now Twig) updates for 3 years, convinced of the possibilities that it provides.

However the learning curve to understanding and using either still elude me.  Yes I have read The Tinderbox Way, and I understand the philosphy of not wanting to impose a method of use on others.

However, like many people I'm busy and for some reason am not able to grasp all the items of Tinderbox/Twig sufficiently from the online manual, or intuitively from playing around with it.

What I want is an inductive, affective and intensive orientation, around immediate real world use.  Now a manual with a ramp up would be a start, or ideally someone who uses Tinderbox/Twig being able to coach me through start up and set up.

So anyone out there who provides 1 day intensive ramp up courses for Tinderbox/Twig?  I'm in London and very willing to pay for that help.

Tnx, Jason

Title: Re: Tinderbox for dummies
Post by Mark Anderson on May 9th, 2011, 5:57am

Jason, why not drop me a line (mwra@mac.com)? I'm down on the South Coast, so not far from you. I'm sure I can help get you up and running, either face to face or screen share. A good part of the problem of getting started is the degree of choice available - if it's any consolation, at outset I spend many months first with the demo and then having bought TB trying to figure it out. If there's no one right way and many choices, where to start?  :)

Individual users' perception of and intended use of TB varies widely, so a one-size-fits-all answer for such a multi-facetted is hard and I think that's why such a catch-all primer doesn't exist. The attendant paradox is that of writing step-by-step descriptions for an app one of whose key aspects is it doesn't have a single right way to do things. Indeed, this is why questions here often get initial response "What are you actually trying to do?".


Title: Re: Tinderbox for dummies
Post by Jason Clark on May 9th, 2011, 6:14am

Dear Mark,

Your help would be appreciated.  I feel like someone buying a motorbike, who is told to watch video of people riding and bike, then to learn how to ride a motorbike on their own.  There are some key things to understand about tinderbox, what does what, and what can be used in service of what, that would enable me to use those against what I am trying to do :-)

Inductively see how others use it, enables me to understand how I might use it.

In terms of use, I'm wanting to use Tinderbox/Twig for PhD research, taking notes, making connections, and establishing ides and then pulling that into outlines for writing.

I'm on SW edge of London and could ride down to where you are?

Cheers, Jason

Title: Re: Tinderbox for dummies
Post by Rich Shields on May 9th, 2011, 8:51am

Jason, I am with you on that need. I am slowly learning, but something still isn’t quite there.

But I live in the KC area smack dab in the middle of the US. So, Mark, can you “drive” here? ;) ;D

Title: Re: Tinderbox for dummies
Post by Jason Clark on May 9th, 2011, 9:03am

Rich: Now I go to Kansas City once a year, maybe when I get up to speed I can drop in to yours and pass on what Mark is going to show me :-)

Title: Re: Tinderbox for dummies
Post by Mark Anderson on May 9th, 2011, 9:38am

Rich, maybe not drive but Skype or iChat with screen sharing is something I've done with US-based folk. Given decent broadband both ends (and some daytime time zone overlap!) it works quite well.

Title: Re: Tinderbox for dummies
Post by Jean Goodwin on May 9th, 2011, 2:56pm

Now that Skype does groups up to 8-10 or so, having Tinderbox afternoons on set topics for those of us in out of the way places would be great!

Title: Re: Tinderbox for dummies
Post by Paul Walters on May 9th, 2011, 3:35pm

@Jean that's a terrific idea!  Maybe Tinderbox mornings with Mark A (unless he wishes to stay up late!?) and afternoons with other noted experts.  

Title: Re: Tinderbox for dummies
Post by Mark Anderson on May 9th, 2011, 3:37pm

My understanding is that Skype does multiway video calls but only person to person screen sharing. Still true?

Title: Re: Tinderbox for dummies
Post by Paul Walters on May 9th, 2011, 3:46pm

Over here, for meetings we use glance.net which has a modest cost and nice features.  There are many other similar services.

Title: Re: Tinderbox for dummies
Post by Mark Bernstein on May 9th, 2011, 6:11pm

We'd be open to trying a small-group remote tutorial.

Has anyone out there studied the alternative vendors?  I'm betting there's some good expertise in the audience.

Title: Re: Tinderbox for dummies
Post by Mark Anderson on May 9th, 2011, 6:24pm

I'd echo Mark B's last question.  There are a lot off offerings out there all with subtly different offerings. Some screen-shares do one-to-many but only from the instructors screen.  Doing non-to-one work (normally with Skype screen share) I find it necessary for both parties to be able to show screen; sometimes you really need to see the actions relating to the process described - especially where instructions don't yield the same results both ends.

Another overlooked factor is recording sessions. I'd think most attendees in a group session might want to record the session ni some way, though I think that's only available in the higher end (and more expensive offerings).

I would be certainly useful to hear from those who've used these tools - especially if you're the person paying for the service as opposed to an attendee. I'm sure none of these systems is perfect, but there must be some standouts that aren't Enterprise priced.

Title: Re: Tinderbox for dummies
Post by Jean Goodwin on May 9th, 2011, 8:08pm

Actually, one group I'm in has indeed settled on Skype as a way to get started.  Everyone already knew how to use it, and we decided that "the best is the enemy of the good"--it was more important to meet good enough and now than to meet really well, sometime in the future.  

Plus after trying it, my view is that what would most improve our meetings would be improved distance-interaction skills (i.e., learning to adapt in-person meeting skills to a new context) rather than improved technology.

Title: Re: Tinderbox for dummies
Post by Rich Shields on May 10th, 2011, 9:40am

For our seminary classes I teach, we use Mega Meeting. I can share my desktop wither everyone (and designate others to share). And when not sharing desktop everyone sees everyone else. On-screen limit is sixteen participants. They have audio included, but we found that a separate conference call was better for our uses. They charge $225/month for unlimited meetings during the month. Conference call charges are extra (so not good for overseas meetings).

For our non-profit work, it was the cheapest alternative for the number of people we have.

Title: Re: Tinderbox for dummies
Post by AGHorne on May 10th, 2011, 10:17am

I'd be willing to pay money for this, too!

Title: Re: Tinderbox for dummies
Post by Mark Anderson on May 10th, 2011, 11:02am

I see Skype just got bought by Microsoft. Not sure what that holds for the Mac & Linux Skype users.

Title: Re: Tinderbox for dummies
Post by Rich Shields on May 10th, 2011, 11:38am

I have friends who use Skype and the most recent update is not very friendly to the Mac side. Since I have not used it I can’t evaluate.

Title: Re: Tinderbox for dummies
Post by Jason Clark on May 11th, 2011, 1:40am

So this is the kind of orientation I'm in need of, and suspect many other Tinderbox user are.

http://mac.appstorm.net/reviews/productivity-review/taking-the-information-plunge-with-tinderbox/

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