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Tinderbox Users >> Moving to Tinderbox 6 >> Are WikiLinks still supported?
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Message started by Ben Worthington on Aug 19th, 2014, 7:17am

Title: Are WikiLinks still supported?
Post by Ben Worthington on Aug 19th, 2014, 7:17am

I can't seem to create one by cmd-option clicking on a WikiLink.

Title: Re: Are WikiLinks still supported?
Post by Mark Anderson on Aug 19th, 2014, 9:22am

I don't believe these are implemented in v6.

Title: Re: Are WikiLinks still supported?
Post by Mark Bernstein on Aug 19th, 2014, 11:22am

Not yet

Title: Re: Are WikiLinks still supported?
Post by Paul Holbrook on Jul 15th, 2016, 4:18pm

I was excited to see mention of WikiLinks in "The Tinderbox Way", and disappointed to find that it doesn't exist in TB 6.  I've always love the ease with which you could start a new topic in a wiki right from the text you're writing.

It's clearly not a topic of great interest - searching for WikiLinks in this forum yielded only a few links.  

I'm guessing that since Mark B just replied "not yet" in 2014 to this thread, that WikiLinks are perhaps on the discard pile of history.  

I've read about CMD+Shift+L, which is helpful, but only if you're linking to something that already exists.

Title: Re: Are WikiLinks still supported?
Post by Mark Bernstein on Jul 17th, 2016, 8:35am

They're not on the discard pile.

They’ve also not been a priority, in part for purely logistical reasons, but also because the collapse of Wikipedia has colored, and to a considerable extent discredited, the Wiki movement.  There’s still an interesting underlying idea to explore in Wikilinks, and it's in the Tinderbox 7 roadmap, but the Tinderbox footnote tool as well as  fast-and-easy link-making in Tinderbox makes WikiLinks less urgent.

Title: Re: Are WikiLinks still supported?
Post by Simon Smailus on Aug 23rd, 2016, 1:19pm

I'm not sure I understand the failure of the wiki movement? I would have thought that if the hyperlink is as important as a full stop, then wiki's would also be highly important?

I'm looking to create a online wiki, and have wondered if Tinderbox would be able to achieve this. It's a shame the wikilink is not yet implemented.

I've been contemplating the value of blogs. There are so many of them and many posts are unconnected. I'm wondering that if a blog was a wiki it would create greater focus for the author? What an author writes should add to what they have already written. It's easier to shoot off a blog post that doesn't really contribute a great deal. Blogs seem to encourage this whereas wiki's seem to allow you to see the whole of what you have written so far. I also think that wiki's capture the idea that nothing is really written, but re-written. Wiki's allow a greater development of content as it can be added to over time. Blogs seem far too linear. Sorry for the digression!

Title: Re: Are WikiLinks still supported?
Post by Mark Anderson on Aug 23rd, 2016, 3:35pm

It's worth noting the TB's wikilinks were internal and not exportable. This is a summary of the old feature. The old feature made it possible to make a TBX - as used within the Tinderbox app - work sa bit like a wiki.  It couldn't be exported, and also not using wiki mark-up. By default you'd have HTML and would have to convert some mark-up to wiki mark-up. This is just for the record - I'm not passing observation as to whether the feature was good or not: I only used it to test the feature's properties.

I think perhaps Wikis do have a problem in that (note - I'm generalising here [sic]) people don't always share/collaborate within wikis as well as they imagine they do when talking about using wikis. Plus, a majority of people struggle to code in wiki mark-up. That's an informal take away from some recent research looking at wikis. It doesn't mean they are bad in principle. But they are perhaps less of a panacea than assumed (especially by those with little hands-on wiki expertise).

Title: Re: Are WikiLinks still supported?
Post by Simon Smailus on Aug 23rd, 2016, 4:59pm

I can see your point as demonstrated with Wikipedia. I suppose I'm looking at the single user. If I took all the material I wrote and put it into a wiki that would make the material far more usable. I like the fact that you can explore information through the links you click rather than through a linear page alone. I don't necessarily read a book in chapter order. Often we read first what interests us most. I'm partly querying the linear form of text now that technology makes it easier to have non linear formats. I think that for many subjects a hyperlink approach is to be preferred and a wiki seems to me to exemplify this.

The blog relies on search whereas the wiki; if well crafted; on links and I think links are to be preferred. A wiki forces the creator to look at structure and how thinks relate, whereas blogs tend to be chronological. I know they have categories and tags, but they appear secondary.

Title: Re: Are WikiLinks still supported?
Post by Mark Anderson on Aug 23rd, 2016, 5:45pm

@Simon, I'd agree re personal use. I notice actually many wikis don't use CamelCase links - as per the original design concept - as after a while writing/naming can become a bit contrived to get new unique WikiWords. The other issue is having to add 'nowiki' markup around CamelCase words (common in today's tech-infused writing) that you don't want as links. Of course, if you're only writing for your your own reading then the effort is moot!

What I believe is Ward Cunningham's original wiki is at http://c2.com, now only accessible in read-only form.

Title: Re: Are WikiLinks still supported?
Post by Mark Bernstein on Aug 24th, 2016, 1:39pm

For some of my writing on the Wiki disaster, see http://www.markbernstein.org/Wiki.html.  

I've written a great deal on the importance of links, and said quite a bit on Wikis. I've keynoted the ACM Wiki conference, and later served as its program chair.

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